Are you consumed with how you are going to get more money? I know the feeling but life doesn’t have to be scarcity all the time 

In this episode, Carolina interviews money coach Suze how we get more money and keep it.

What you’ll learn:
1:24 Who Suze is and how she helps the world
6:35 What is a money relationship and what should that look like?
8:57 Carolina’s view on money relationship
11:56 The root or core of the money relationship for people
17:54 More money = more problems
25:20 Conflict resolution
30:42 How Suze helps other people with their money relationships

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Professional bio
The Carolina Sotomayor Podcast is brought to you by Carolina Sotomayor and the Fertility Foundation.

Carolina Sotomayor is an Expert Womb Healer who helps women conceive by removing physiological blockages with Reiki. She is the host of the Carolina Sotomayor Podcast, a show that covers everything from fertility to postpartum to motherhood, and the creator of Fertility Foundation Collective, an online membership that helps women heal at their own pace to boost their fertility.

Carolina has served over 500 women from around the world to heal. She is passionate about helping women create their families. As a result, there are over 60 reiki babies in the world.

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Full episode transcript:

Hi, I am Caroline. You’re a podcast host, an Reiki womb healer, and today we are gonna be talking about something I think that is so important for every woman to know. So no matter if you’re postpartum, you’re pregnant, or you’re getting ready to prepare for birth, or you’re in your fertility journey trying to conceive, you’re a baby, every woman needs to know about.

So today’s episode, all women mothers need to know about money and how to get it with Suza McLean Po. Suza. Thank you for calling in today and taking the time outta your busy schedule to meet with us. I’m so happy to be here, Caroline. I’m so grateful for you. When I saw your picture online, I was like, I need her on my podcast.

You have such an amazing energy about you, and I just had loved everything that I had read about you. Can you share with our listeners a little bit about you? Were you in the world and how do you serve the world? Because I think that your background is so unique to how other people and other people in the online space, you have a very special background related to.

Yes. Thank you so much, Carolina. Yeah, so I am in the Netherlands, which is in Europe, in the northwest part of Europe. I live there about an hour east of Amsterdam. Um, I grew up in North Carolina, but I am Dutch and I live here and I live here together with my husband and two teenage kids of 15 and 16 and a dog and cats and chicken.

Um, and I have my own seminar room here. Today I am a trauma therapist and a business coach. Well, basically I teach them how to set up a business around your voice and around what it is that you set out to do in this world. But I didn’t start that way. I started out as a ship builder. As a ship building engineer.

Ways and, um, cold the boat, literally, quite the pun intended there. You were a ship builder? Yes. Wow. How did I not know this? That’s fucking incredible. . Yeah, so when I was 18, I had to choose some kind of topic and I was literally interested in everything. Astronomy, English literature, ship building and and law and everything in between.

I just couldn’t choose because everything I see or hear about I wanna know in depth. So I’m in awe of you right now. Well, ship building was something I couldn’t study later on in my own spare time, so that’s why I thought, you know what? Let’s do that in a university. And also it was a kind of a wise choice, right?

My parents said, don’t go to good school. Uh, don’t I know that music. I played the violin. Don’t even think about it. There’s no money in that, stuff like that. So I thought, you know what? Let’s do something that I absolutely love. I absolutely love ships. But what I loved about those projects is that actually all these people had to work together and had to.

Show up from their best place. And I love that because innovations are driven by passion and by people doing something that nobody knows how to do yet. So I came in a world where people were forced or asked or required to do something that they didn’t have a lot of certainty or security around. And that was something I really loved because then, Behind the scenes of these projects.

I would talk to all these people and I would hear them, hear their passion, hear why they were joining this project. But what really struck me is that once they weren’t in a project, that passion energy would disappear again. And they would be like, okay, but now everybody’s watching. Now I have to be rational, strategic, whatever.

And I wondered why. Why are we not just showing up from that great place inside ourselves? Why is it that the moment that we think about building our life or building our business, or building a project like this, as soon as other people are involved, we feel responsible. We feel that we need to take care of things.

We feel that we can’t just be us because that would never be enough. And that was the same split that I had because I felt safe on a ship, but I didn’t feel safe on shore. And that was something that really got me curious to, why are we being so stupid? Why isn’t not normal that we just show up? The way we are from the place that we love and with our passion, isn’t that what life should be about?

Now? I didn’t know how to do it, but that’s where I started to become interested in people more than in ships and in psychology. And I did 30 different kinds of coaching certifications and eventually became a trauma therapist because I just wanted to get to the bottom of it, and I wanted to understand.

What is really holding us back from just simply creating the life that we were meant to create. So you grew up, it was a tough upbringing, but full of love. And then from there you went into ship building. And from ship building you learned your passion for ships and, but also learning that you have this great ability to be who you are in that world.

Then you went on to ship innovation projects, so then you could. Be living your dream half of the year and then the other half supporting it. And then you went on to discover that you love people and wanted to come. So you became a trauma certified therapist and now that’s what you are and that’s what makes you different than other money teachers in the world.

So let’s dive into the money park cuz our listeners, I bet you are biting at the bit. So what is a money relationship and what should that look like? When people have a relationship with money, what should that look like or what can it look like? It’s actually interesting because what we see around this one, we hear a lot of people think that it looks like, is that if we have a great relationship with money, that means that we have a lot of it.

So we ha we’re all born and raised in high school to think, you know what, you should be successful. You should earn a lot of money, you should have security, um, and you should know how to do all of this. Um, But the interesting thing is what we’re trained to think is that money will actually create a great life for us, and if we have enough money and we’re intelligent enough to make a lot of money, then we’ll be okay.

The interesting thing is money is just a thing that we use to trade. That’s all it is. It’s not. Like, uh, a strawberry or mango or something that is in nature and that we can get right. We actually created it ourselves, and not even that long ago because our human d n A is 6 million years old, but the root of money or the root of exchanging goods so that we could trade easier is only about 20,000 years.

So we created it. So it’s not like there is something out there that if we accumulate enough, then we’ll be safe because it’s just an agreement that if you do something for me, then I’ll give you something in return. But in a society of thousands of people, that’s pretty hard to do. So if you do something for me and I don’t want what you can do in return, you know?

You’ll give me money and then I can choose whatever it is that I like best in return. That’s all money is. So then if we look at it from that point, a relationship with money basically just comes down to actually helping somebody with something that they really need and receiving and accepting something in exchange for that.

That’s all It’s. So you’re talking about money as being in exchange? Yes. I was thinking more of, of, when I think about a money relationship, I think of it more as like a relationship you might have with another person. Mm-hmm. , like how do you think of it? Yeah. Like how you speak of it, how you feel about it.

What are you doing to nurture it? What are you doing to learn more about it? How much time are you dedicating to it towards it? A quite literal sense of it. Oh, I agree. Yeah, I agree. Because the thing. If we get back to, Hey, it’s just a means of exchange, then what we can easily start to see is that the only way we can ever accumulate money is by treating other people really well.

That is the only thing we can do. Even if we go to the stock market or to buying and selling houses or something of real estate, um, it all has to do. An exchange of people. So then money actually is the carrier of how we relate to people. So then, for instance, this is something big I discovered. I’ve lost everything in my life four times.

And through those experiences, one of the things I learned is that it’s actually really easy to come back on that and. Turn your life around. I thought I was the kind of person who’s always losing everything until I realized why. Easy at losing things. But I’m also easy at building them back. And then I thought, why do we make it so complicated?

And then I realized what we do is we think that we need money in order to build a life. But what I realized is if we just build our life, And we build beautiful relationship with people. Money comes in. Now if we look at it that way, what we need to realize is that our relationship with money is just as it as our only way to get money is by building great relationships with people.

Our relationship with money is actually showing us how we do that. So, for instance, I am very well known to tell people, you know what? Show me your relationship with money. And it can show you exactly what your relationships look like in the rest of your life and how you treat your work, how you treat your partners, because the relationship you have with money is actually the carrier of how you relate in the.

Now that could be pretty, wow, that could be pretty painful. , can you say that again? Is actually a carrier or a, A very easy way to see how you relate with the people around you and with your work and how much space you allow yourself on this planet. Relationship you have with money is an indicator of how you relate to others and how much space you allow yourself in this world.

Yes. Now that’s quote, so what is the root of the money relationship for people? Like what is the core? The core of our money relationship has everything to do with the relationship we have built with life from before we were. And the interesting thing is, before we’re seven, we didn’t even handle money.

Right? Well, I didn’t and I, I hope for certain that our listeners didn’t have to deal with money before they were seven. I let my five-year-old handle money. I let him pay for things. Yeah. I let him, cuz for me, we, I grew up super poor and I want him to know that it’s a tool and we say things like every time we swipe our debit card, we like there’s more where that came from.

That’s beautiful. That’s be. Yeah, it’s really important for me because I have worked so hard on my scarcity mindset that. He understands that like if we don’t have the money at this moment that it’s coming or that we’re gonna save up for it, it’s yet, it’s yet, it doesn’t mean that we can’t ever have it.

It just means yet, and then the waiting is actually part of the fun. The saving is part of the fun. It’s not the possession of it, but also the joy of satisfaction of having to work hard for it. Yeah, he also likes receipts. He likes numbers, so I always ask the cashier to hand him the receipt and he holds onto it.

He never loses a receipt. He has like a little money purse and he puts all his receipts in nex his car seat. It’s really interesting to see how he enjoys money at five and a half versus like, like me as a 39 year old self. It’s so funny to see as like as a. As cuz you might be related to as much trauma that I have overcome, as much trauma that I have healed.

I hear my mother-in-law say, holy. He reminds me so much of Ryan when he was his age. But when I look at my son, he doesn’t remind me of my five-year-old self. He reminds me of myself now. It’s really wild. That’s beautiful. It’s really wild because there is. I don’t see much of my child’s self in him. I see my adult healed self with him and I was like, that was like a revelation I think I had last week I was talking with a friend and I was like, you know, I think that when you do trauma work and you do a lot of.

Different, like if you are very intentional about your healing, it definitely impacts positively of course in all areas of your life, but especially in your parenting, so like Absolutely. Yeah. I was a very quiet five year old. I was a very reserved, scared. Five year old, cuz I quiet meant I was safe. It was a safer way of me being.

Yeah. My five-year-old is not quiet. He’s boisterous, he’s confident, he feels secure. Some people say, oh, he’s sassy. I was like, no, that’s confidence. That’s assertiveness. That’s him finding his voice and he’s also very well mannered and polite and respectful, but he is a person that speaks his voice. It’s really interesting to have.

That kind of turnaround because there are things that he does. But when I ask my mom that question, she goes, yeah, I mean, he looks a little bit like you, but like he does things that he doesn’t remind me of you when you were little. So it’s really wild that there’s some things that he does with my husband’s.

And then, so these zero to seven. I told my husband, I was like, we gotta hit this home run. We gotta get this cuz this matters for the rest of his life. Cuz I have learned that in my own reiki practice, zero to seven is a lot of the undoing that I’m doing in the healing work. So zero to seven matters so much.

Very true. Very, very true. Yeah. You know, from zero to seven we learn. How we’re okay in this world on very different levels. So how we can actually be welcome and be present here. How we’re safe with our needs, how we’re safe to relate to other people. How we’re safe to experiment with our own willpower and how we can create things, how we’re safe to express ourselves fully, and how we’re safe to make mistakes and to feel vulnerable and to actually ask for support.

All these different things we learn from zero to seven. And all the trauma that we build up in these ages is something that we project onto everything in life, onto our relationships, but also onto our relationship with money. With money. So then what we see is, . If I look at somebody’s relationship with money with them, I can point out where things have gone wrong in their life and we can heal that.

So for instance, that’s really a great gift. I have never met anyone that has been able to like, I never thought about that. Let’s look at your money relationship. It’s usually the other way around. Yes, let’s look at everything else and then like they never get to the money part, but let’s start with the money part and like, what is this mirror?

And work. Go straight there. Exactly. That’s really clever. I like that. It’s much quicker and easier. It’s really strategic way of healing. It is. Because what I believe is I actually, people want more money. They want more money to pay for fertility treatment. They want more money for groceries. Exactly. Like they need more money for basic things.

And a lot of people in the online space is like, oh yeah, they just, you know, you know. Push this high ticket and like people just wanna have the basic things. They want a house, they want food. They don’t wanna worry about if their debit card’s gonna pass through the grocery market. Like, am I gonna have enough?

I don’t know how much is in there. I’m too scared to even look at the balance. Exactly. I hope this works out, you know? Yeah. Yeah. What a great way to do it. I like that a lot. What do you think? If we heal our bank account in the amount that’s there, that we can heal our life? Oh, I learned a long time ago.

More money help, but it doesn’t change the behaviors or habits. Exactly, exactly. So more money actually equals probably larger problems. It just larger, stable problems. So if you have a fitting problem and not a balance, Act of saving enough or budgeting, you don’t have those correct behaviors, then all basically, you’re just gonna be in just larger scale problems.

Yes. Yeah. And the, you know, the safer you feel around receiving money and nurturing yourself, dealing with your own needs, uh, being, feeling welcome here, not feeling dependent on other people’s opinions. The more safe you feel there, the easier it is if you lose everything to build it. Because it’s so hard, because we feel so dependent on money, because so true.

If we have 5 million in the bank, then we won’t have to look at all that trauma but’s true. I think that’s actually not the right way around. Some people are not ready to heal yet, and I think that that’s okay. I think it’s when they are ready to heal, then that’s when the transformation, or it’s not necessarily when they’re ready, but maybe sometimes.

They need to Exactly. Depending on the thing. Sometimes I can be a little bit of a procrastinator in my own healing, like, you know, there are certain things I have struggled with, but when it came, like it reared his ugly head in, like my family, meaning like, like I got triggered with my son. There’s nothing I won’t do for my son.

So that that’s indicative of like me and my inner child of prioritizing myself. I’ve learned to always put people above me, but I will always, okay, so this behavior or whatever needed to be fixed within me with showing up or complicating my relationship with my child. I need to heal that in order to be a better parent.

Okay, then I’ll do it. But it wasn’t necessarily. From the place of nurturing myself, but it was for the love of my child, so it came out of a need. So I think that sometimes if we look at like why we need to do something is also equally important as to as much as what we need to do because the why. And this might be kind of controversial, but I think the why, if it’s good enough to get the person started moving in the direction that they’re wanting to go, where they need to go, and it’s empowered enough, that’s good enough.

So for the sake of me, I need to heal my family. I needed, I think it was probably my temper. People are like, you have a temper. Trust me, I do. If you’re triggered, you’re sleep deprived. You are running off a coffee. Oh, you get a temper then? Yeah. Oh, you’ll get a temper. You get unhinged and short fused real quick.

And if it’s like, I get overstimulated by noise very easily, so we can only have one noise in the house at a time. Yeah, and I don’t know what that’s indicative of, but I just know that like I need to have. Low noise. So like it’s one toy or no tv, no dishwasher. It’s like one thing. I just know that controlling or grounding so that my temper is not so escalated and, but I’m doing that because I love my kid and I want him to not have a bad mom or a bad mom in the moment.

that’s good enough for. I should be loving myself enough that I wanna do that for me, but really that’s not where I’m at in my face. So know your why and sometimes your why is not about you, and that’s okay. That’s okay. And people don’t say that. That’s like. Maybe sometimes like I’m changing behavior. I not necessarily know, but you know why?

But I’m improving my listening skills cuz my husband says he doesn’t feel heard enough. Well, I’m just gonna sit here and be silent. Do I understand really what I’m doing? No. But I also know I’m preserving my marriage in response to making a loving action. I don’t really understand all the pieces of what he was saying, but I’m just gonna sit here.

And act like he’s heard, but and sometimes that’s good enough. And I think that that needs to be told too. Like everything comes in pieces. I, I fully agree. Yeah. I, you know, the thing is, when I got pregnant with my oldest son, my boyfriend, who I then had left me when I was eight weeks pregnant, so all of a sudden I was a single mom.

Wow, with my own business and I was 30 years old. I only had my business for five years, and again, I was losing everything and I was really happy that I was pregnant, but all my childhood trauma. Surfaced . I didn’t have a clue of what was going on inside of me. I was all alone. I didn’t have a lot of support around me or, or, well, I did have loving people.

I didn’t have a lot of people who really understood what was going on in my life, and I had to be a mom and I was all alone. So sometimes we deal with things by suppressing them just as you say. I cannot deal with that noise. Well, maybe I can teach you to deal with better noise handling. That’s great.

But right now we also need to suppress certain things so that we can actually stay present. And there is always that balance as well. Yeah. Sometimes it’s not about us function. Sometimes it’s about. Trying to be a kind of a decent mom and deal with all these things, but I often think my kids are now 15 and 16, and I apologize to them every day saying, you know what?

I think this is also motherhood. In hindsight, we know what we should have done. And I actively apologize to my five-year old, and I also will actively argue in front of him with my spouse. We do it in a healthy way because I think it’s important for him to see conflict. I agree. Yeah. To that. How can helpfully deal with that?

conflict and we, we don’t raise our voices when we argue. We don’t do name calling, but those are also like healthy boundaries we had established, yeah, while we were dating and also we’ve gone through a shit ton of marriage conferences. Like I had to learn how to be a good wife. I knew how to get divorced cuz I saw that.

But like I had to actively learn how to be a good spouse. And in those marriage conferences, I don’t agree with all the things in the marriage conferences meaning like I believe. Who you choose to love is who you love. I live, I believe in gay marriage, all of the things. So now we’re very selective of where we go, but there is a lot of principles on like how to treat each other with respect.

It’s important to have differences, but how do you actively choose them? I had learned that it’s not necessarily for us in this season of life about. Controlling your temper or anything. It’s more about making sure each other are being seen. Exactly. And then focusing on good conflict resolution. If I have good conflict resolution, a lot of the other mess and noise goes away.

I agree. I was actively talking about this with my partner, with my husband, and I said, that’s the missing. I said that’s the missing piece in all of this. It wasn’t my temper, it was not all my physical needs were being met, meaning sleep, food, rest, water. But I was like conflict resolution. If I can teach that to my son, yeah.

He’ll be light years ahead cuz it’s not about, yeah. Do we want no bullying? Do we want all of that? But like if I can equip him with, cuz all of that’s, But if I can equip him with solutions and tools in conflict resolution and feel confident in his ability to maneuver those things, then he’s a fucking ninja.

That’s a boss move. There’s a flex and then there’s one extra element that’s can tell me that’s actually what our relationship with money can can enhance in that. My husband and I met when I was eight months pregnant, so we didn’t have an easy start. We had a baby after five days. Wow. That’s a story. Oh, that’s a whole story.

We could have won an entire podcast about that , but that, that’s a really interesting story. But the interesting thing is, After a year and a half of being together, we had two kids and we moved to, to the other side of the country. So basically that is enough recipe for divorce, if anything. Right. Oh wow.

Yeah, that’s a lot of stress. , yeah. There was a lot of stress going on between us and we went to all the marriage counselors available. We did tan together. We did all kinds of really beautiful, really helpful things, diving up our traumas of our past, um, and, and stuff like that. But we still couldn’t resolve that last part of conflict.

There was always this point of we agreed to not go there. And that can be fine. But there was this, I don’t know, this thing and actually opening up our conversations about what our relationship with money was really about, given that there’s trauma behind that. From our parents from before we were seven that actually really opened up.

And what that did was not just the conflict resolution that you were talking about, even though I agree we absolutely need that, but it was allowing ourselves to feel all the feelings behind it while Oh, that’s so true. Is watching. So when you, in order, it’s hard, especially for Americans, but also for very hard for men cuz we’re, they’re taught not to feel.

Absolutely. You’re not a man if you are crying. You’re not a man if you are feeling too much or if you’re emotional, you’re not masculine or machito. I’m Hispanic, so like if you’re not macho enough, yeah. Are you a man? So, and then, but then for women, we’re allowed to feel, but then we’re being taught often that we can feel and then have other people comfort us.

But we’re not taught to actually create a holding space for our feelings so that they can really resolve, so we can allow other people to dry our tears. But can we feel underneath those tears into the heart of the issue so that we can actually emerge from our soul space instead of from a comfort space?

Does that make sense? That is something I didn’t learn until my thirties . No. And that was after seeing a shaman, a hypnosis therapist, going through all these hundreds of hours of Reiki training. Like seriously. That was like a lot. And that was thousands of dollars later. . Yeah. But a lifetime of happiness.

Right? That’s, it is true though. If I hadn’t gone through all of that though, I wouldn’t be, I’m really happy with the kind of parent I am. I don’t think that that I could be the parent I am now if I wasn’t operating from a salt space. So essentially to further better your relationship with money is you need to be able to feel your emotions, but also connect to your soul essentially.

Exactly. You can start to feel the emotions as they come up. Start to identify what those emotions are, and then find a way to release them. Yes. Like so that’s what you believe then from zero to seven years old. But why do you, as an adult self, whatever age you are now? What do you believe? Money to be true.

I used to believe money used to call when I did some money exercises last year on my money mindset and my money relationship. I unconsciously believed money caused conflict exactly. And that’s every time that there was money, cuz when I was young, my mom had custody of me for from zero to 16. And then at 16 to 18 I went to live with my dad.

There was always a child custody battle going on in child support, so there was not enough money or he was arguing that he had to pay the money or she was on welfare to pay for money cuz he refused to pay. And there was. All of this because I existed, someone has to pay for me, but nobody wanted to take accountability for me.

So like I learned, if there’s money, that means there’s fighting, that means there’s conflict and that just means that money is misery. Yes. So as an adult, for me, I replaced that is money provides me options. Yes. That’s, and I believe options give you opportunities for greater happiness, and that’s what I replace it with.

If you have money, you have options. If you have options, you have opportunities for greater happiness. Yes. Because there’s more than one way to do something. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. So the, the first thing I do with people is look at their relationship with money is actually really. Pointing towards just like your example, just like you said, often there is a hidden thing going on underneath that, but just knowing it isn’t enough.

So I really help people heal those things because most coaches will teach you to let it go, and that’s great. We actually no need to embrace it and love everything. Happened in our past. I had to actually like think about it. I had to say, okay, what do I believe about money? What is the first time, what’s my first memory about money?

What was the situation? Who were the relationships? And then also then when I was like remembering that what came up for me in my physical body, like in my chest space and my heart chakra and like then I had to release that. Yes. Like I had to like process that. Memory and like I had to take time to like det trigger it.

Exactly. Yeah. So I don’t believe like you breathe and let it go, you have to actively do some kind of exercise. Exactly. Or talk it out so that you can. Move to, for me it’s about, it’s det triggering means to move to a place of neutrality. I have a very controversial opinion about forgiveness. I don’t necessarily think forgiveness sometimes is to be had.

It’s a very individual, personal thing. Sometimes I, there are certain situations in my life that I will just never forgive. I’m not gonna hold onto that story. That’s a choice. But I am also moved to a place as much as I can in neutrality around a certain life of. So for me, that’s how I had to, to get to it.

And then I’m like, before I could even get to, okay, what are my new beliefs about money? How am I replacing this so that, yeah, be careful with if anyone says release and let go. Love and light. Yeah. No, that makes absolutely no sense at all. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. And forgiveness is a process. And the thing is, it’s not always about forgiving the other person.

It’s about actually seeing that we’re all human and that nobody probably intended to hurt you but didn’t have any other option. That doesn’t mean you have to make okay what happened, because a lot of things that happened are not okay. But it does mean that you have to be able to step. That’s a very different thing.

So a lot of my listeners are trying to conceive the need is basic. They want more money for I B F I U I fertility treatments. So how do they get more of it? What I would say is to actually embrace who they are. Look at their relationship with money and with why they wanted. It’s not just the Yeah, but I want these treatments.

It’s the Yeah, but what do these treatments really mean? What is really going on here? Why is this so important for me? And really embrace that and really embrace the fact that you need it so that you can actually start opening up to receive it. Now, there is more to be said about that. Yeah. I’m asking you to answer your entire.

Practice of so many years, and one question and under a minute, it’s pretty un it’s pretty wild. So how can people find you? How can people access you? How can they work with you? How can they communicate with you? So we have@suzmcleanpoon.com. Um, that’s my website. And what you will find there is, uh, something called the money Miracles course, and that is a course that opens up four times a year.

The doors are opening in November. The course starts in January, beginning of January. What we do there is that we really look at all these different stages of your childhood, um, and we heal your relationship with money. It’s a five week course. And it will do deep trauma healing as it comes to money. So it’s an online modules, but there’s live Zoom deep trauma healing with a small group of beautiful people.

And me, of course, and I will hold the space and do the healing sessions with people, and that will actually create a very different foundation from where you build your life. I love that. That’s something that will start now. Well, it’s, it’s open. Yeah, I love that. I’ll make sure to put that in the show notes and for people to go ahead and be able to access that.

Yes. Suzette, thank you so much for being here. I love talking to you. You are a whole vibe, and I hope you have the best day in the Netherlands. Thank you so much for having me, Carolina, and I hope to meet you real soon. I really enjoyed our talk. All right. Thank you so much. Have a good day.